Halinski 1:33 Spitfire Vb - New method

    Hi dear friends


    After finishing the Dragon Wagon, I took a long time out. . I started a new project - The Halinski Spitfire 1:33. Although I already bought some new vehicals models such as the Modelik Bradley, KFZ70 Krupp and some GPM's, I wanted to make another airplane and I had the Halinski Spitfire. I started it about more than a year ago and left it for few monthes. Then the Modelik's scud appeared and I ordered it. since it took some time to come I returned to the Spitfire but decided to built it in anew way.


    The aircraft modeks ussualy built as they came from the manufacturer - Clean, nice and complete shape. However in real life it wasn't like that - The planes were dirty, heavily bumped, oil links from almost every parts etc. Another thing is that the planes were built from many metal sheets, and they were anything but smooth looking. Therefor, until the Scud arrives.. I desided to continue with the Spitfire in a different realistic way. I decided to built it from many sheets of paper - hence - cut every pieces of the fuselage covering and glue them as separate sheets, withe alittle overlaping as it was in the Spitfires. Also, I cut out every part from the wings, and glue it again to it's place, as you can see in a plastic models.

    and the final - the body and the wings are covered with paper, but I made from every original piece some shhets, according to the plates which the aircraft eas built from:


    all the parts will be painted later on in order to fill the gaps between the parts.


    I will post later the images of the plane built and painted.



    Cheers!


    Igal

    Interesting concept. Did you shape the parts before cutting them apart by the metal seams? I look forward to seeing more of this build and how it comes out ;)

    Hi


    I had to rescale the plane. All the structure is resize to 98% of it's original (outer skirt) otherwise. I painted the parts only later on.

    Plastic is bad for health


    Gallery


    Tornado - Halinski - 1:33

    Hello Patel,


    I think your attempt to get the "wear & tear", "dirt & grime" effect deserves every respect. Studying photographs, as you did, of war-time aircraft, the misfits between parts, as well as dents in the plating, is often very apparent but seldom well reflected in models.


    Right now I'm thinking of the Suisei. The museum example preserved seems to be extremely dented. Another example for me has been the P39.


    However, it is difficult to get precisely the "right" degree of wear & tear. I might argue that you may have gone a little bit too far.


    But that doesn't detract any from your basic effort. I think you should look upon it as something closer to an impressionistic work of art. And as such I applaud it.


    Leif

    Dankbar für die Gelegenheit auf Englisch schreiben zu dürfen, kann aber Antworten problemlos auf Deutsch lesen.

    I have seen some builds where the individual panel lines were embossed (specifically I was looking at a Halinski Mustang III build on one of the Polish builds earlier today). I am waiting to see the final version of this to compare the results. ;)

    Hi,



    Yes, I cut out the parts and put them back in place with a glue. I also had in mind to emboss the lines, but I thought that the final result would not be as real as overlapping the sheets (about 0.5 mm overlapping, the upper sheet over the lower one). I have some images more but I'm trying to get a better images.

    Plastic is bad for health


    Gallery


    Tornado - Halinski - 1:33

    Edited once, last by patel ().

    Hi


    some final images of the model. The model is painted and I also did a dry brush with pygments.


    The plane from the bottom and overall (I will add some close-up images later):

    Hello fellow paperformers,
    This is indeed interesting. I have built a Super Constellation in this way, and am now working on a DC-6B, scale 1:50, using a balsa wooden framework, which will be covered with panels more or les as the real plane was built up.On the atttached pics you can see the nose forming, and on the other one, I have put the transparant with which I draw the outline of the required panel using the framework as template. I then transfer the drawn panel onto white glossy paper ("Lackpapier" from the artshop), trim as needed and glue that to the frame. It is a lot of work, but it gives a realistic feeling to the model.
    If you're interested, I can show you more pics.
    Regards,
    Robert

    It is indeed very interesting. Note how you are actually preparing for a method of designing/building models with full and realistic interiors. Many steps ahead, but still...


    - L.

    Dankbar für die Gelegenheit auf Englisch schreiben zu dürfen, kann aber Antworten problemlos auf Deutsch lesen.

    Edited once, last by Leif Ohlsson ().

    Welcome Robert!


    The building of this plane belongs definitly into its own thread within this forum. I am looking forward very much seeing your work growing!


    Cheers, Andreas


    PS. Please show us also the Super Constellation in the Galery.

    When the aircraft were built I wonder, did the panels actually overlap or were they butted edge to edge. It might be that it varied from airframe to airframe. Plus a lot of the panels that were over mechanical portions of the airframe (engine, armament, flap motors and the like were covered with removable panels held down either with screws or quick release fasteners. Either way it will be interesting to see the finished build. Another area that this might be a good technique is in the hulls of ships built before welded hulls came into thier own. On rivetted ships the individual plates would overlap to a considerable amount to allow the rivieting to take place. With the right weight card or paper one could even have the plating thickness to scale.

    If we lie to ourselves, what lies will we willingly tell to others

    Hi


    The panels of the fuselage in the Spitfire were overlapped. the section of the motor were covered with a panel. In moders aircraft they are mainly edge to edge. My problem was that the thickness of the paper (in 1:33 scale) is a little bit thicker than the plates should we in this scale, so I used a 80 g paper to make the panels.

    Plastic is bad for health


    Gallery


    Tornado - Halinski - 1:33

    Hi,
    I'm sorry but Your model doesn't resemble a real plane to me. Your idea wasn't right (with cutting all parts), and additionally You glued the skin in something looking like monster. Living near the museum in Cracov I touched several times Spitfire linked below nad assure You it surface was smooth, without holes (multiply them 33 times and show us such holes in real plane) or coming off skin, separated parts with such a big separation. Of course planes was dirty and so one, the skin was a bit "crushed", but plane with skin like in Your model would break up in the air. Please see problems with early Yaks and Lavochkins during II WW - slightly separated skin teared up in the air, so the planes had to get new wings.


    Please look the same models build on polish forums - they are often beeing made "old" and "dirty" but not so separated with gaps.
    Regards TAD


    PS. I will not discus with anybody whose only modellar job is cliking on forum or aim is to kick me - waste of time.



    http://www.airliners.net/open.file/1085945/M/


    http://www.airliners.net/open.file/0902419/M/

    Hi Tad.


    Thank you for the images. I also saw Spitfire in the IAF Museum. However, you cannot compare between aircraft in the museum, where all the openings are totally closed and repainted with brilliant colors, to an aircraft in battle conditions. That's why I did not post the close up images since in photos the gaps are much more evident than they really are.


    Igal

    Plastic is bad for health


    Gallery


    Tornado - Halinski - 1:33

    Hi Patel,
    thank You for the link - very interesting. Well - I could also post some pictures showing planes with holes (even German planes, which I thought to be so precise) but that would be exceptions in my opinion. Even on pictures You linked above Spitfire is smooth - skin has no serious gaps - hovewer they are.


    Other thing is, that making model that refers to speciall plane there is a need to show us, that in this particular plane we can find such gaps and separated skin. When luck of such photos model is rather imagination of author, than replica.


    I really like the "dirt" You've made - like it, but cannot agree with such a strong (gaps) separation of skin.


    Regards
    TAD

    Hi


    I got the idea. The problem that the photos emphasis the "gaps" which you can barley see in the model. That's why I'm nor happy with my photos... The only place the gap is obvious is on the oil tank which has an extra panel. Maybe the gaps in the model more evidence in the photos because I painted the thickness of the paper and it is much more clearly seen in the photos.


    Anyway, until I'll put my hand on a much better camera, I will post some close up images

    Hi,
    probably You're right - I also think that photos could even emphisize problems and in real I couldn't see anything. Camera is somethimes rough judge - eye cannot see so much.


    Anyway - I really like You're way of making the plane teared up and dirty - look fine to me!


    Norm - don't be so shy - even making such a sophisticated model is a success! This Thunderbolt will be my very next plane with report - I will be happy if get this, what You got - so You're report is very helpfull to me. Thud is one of my favourite - I've done it twice and apart from the Halinski one going to build about 4 more...


    Regards
    TAD

    Hi Patel,
    I must say that this is an interesting approach to buidling the model, but I think you overdid it a bit...
    Spitfire had very smooth, clean lines and considering the 1:33 scale, this overlap shouldn't be visible at all.

    Hello, Dieter and all,
    I tried to open a new thread yesterday on the subject of building panelwise on a (balsa)framework, but I pushed the wrong buttons after a beautiful opening, and it was lost in the eternal bytesbin....
    I will try again, probably under the title "Panels on frame" .
    Meanwhile, the Super Connie and the Staratocruiser are not kits at all, but scratch build, from 3-view drawings. The only exception is, that the engines of the SC were copied and adapted from the Schreiber card model of the Lockheed 1649 Starliner, and those of the Statocruiser are loosely based on the engines of the Schreiber Swissair DC-7C.
    Regards,
    Mixbou (Robert)

    Separating many parts of skin on cartoon models is always risky - except when they are fully painted. It's just becouse the paper is not so good material for such experiments.


    Patel - please look at the model showed below - it apears on polish competitions from some time. At first glaze it looks wonderfull! - so many parts, panels, details and so on. But looking him carefully you can see it looks actually awful. Not like a smooth plane like it should be - rather like some monster kind of Frankenstein. Watching this model viever after a while concentrate at gaps and holes - they are just more "visible" (atract our view) than many great details. Avoiding separated skin in models has two purposes:


    - it makes models more like real objects
    - it lets to cheat our eyes - as they have naturall tendency to looking for coming of or protruding things.


    Of course my intention is not to forbid You build like you want - thanks to You we have some new ideas to rethink. I just expressed my point of view.
    Regards
    TAD

    Hi dear Friends!


    I quite agree with you that over detailing is somehow ruin the total effect. It is good only if you try to make a diorama. But, I think that one can built a realistic model and still can be ok if the detailing are not getting out of proportion. It is somewhere in the middle.


    The Spitfire was a test of a new method. I think that there is a lot of room to enhance the method and make some (or many...) Improvements. If I'll build another aircraft in this method, I will surely make some changes in the method. I agree with Norm, and I already stated that I used a 80 mm paper to make the panels. It will be really interesting if someone will apply this method with some improvements.


    Now, I'm building the Modelik Kubelwagen (1:25 scale) until I'll get the order of the enormous Scud. Anyway, I believe that if I'll start the Scud the next model will be about 100 years from now....


    Igal

    Plastic is bad for health


    Gallery


    Tornado - Halinski - 1:33

    Edited once, last by patel ().

    Hi Patel,


    I have taken the freedom to move this topic from "vehicles" to "aircraft".


    Ich habe dieses Thema von "Fahrzeuge" nach "Luftfahrt" verschoben.


    regards / Viele Grüsse
    Michael