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jcvandenbergh

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41

Wednesday, April 6th 2011, 5:24pm

...covering the lower wings; the second image shows the skin portion that must be removed when the airbrakes are to be constructed in an open position; a delicate operation that has to be done before the actual covering.
jcvandenbergh has attached the following images:
  • 53 Gloster Sea Gladiator - kopie.jpg
  • 54 Gloster Sea Gladiator - kopie.jpg

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42

Saturday, April 9th 2011, 9:09pm

...lower wings with wingtips and framework inside dive brake bays:
jcvandenbergh has attached the following images:
  • 55 Gloster Sea Gladiator - kopie.jpg
  • 56 Gloster Sea Gladiator - kopie.jpg

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43

Monday, April 11th 2011, 3:58pm

One of the special features of this model is the tool that has been moulded especially to receive the entire plane. It will be needed in several stages of the build of the model, first to support the lower wings and soon, after adding additional parts to the tool, to support lower and upper wings.
Because of the way in which this model was designed, there is only a rather weak link between the lower wings and the fuselage: just two 1mm. wires; no contact between the wing frames and the fuselage frame, just 'skin to skin' contact.
Therefore it is essential to pay special attention to gluing the two together firmly and in the proper position and the tool is of great help here. In fact it is indispensable.
On the pictures: the specially moulded tool, the model resting on it while the glue is drying, and the model with the lower wings properly attached:
jcvandenbergh has attached the following images:
  • 57 Gloster Sea Gladiator - kopie.jpg
  • 58 Gloster Sea Gladiator - kopie.jpg
  • 59 Gloster Sea Gladiator - kopie.jpg
  • 60 Gloster Sea Gladiator - kopie.jpg
  • 61 Gloster Sea Gladiator - kopie.jpg

Royaloakmin

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44

Monday, April 11th 2011, 5:25pm

Hi JC, and I expect we will see a jig for the upper wing too? The tail planes are added after the upper wing? Looks fantastic.
best regards
mit herzlichen grussen

Fred

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jcvandenbergh

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45

Tuesday, April 12th 2011, 10:40am

@ Royaloakmin: Yes to both questions!

jcvandenbergh

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46

Friday, April 15th 2011, 6:02pm

The upper wing frame under construction; the vertical part is a 'template' needed to check the proper shape and inclination; I fixed it to the frame using tape for as long as necessary. I suppose this template will be part of the 'tool' that I described earlier as soon as the finished upper wing will be fixed.
jcvandenbergh has attached the following images:
  • 62 Gloster Sea Gladiator - kopie.jpg
  • 63 Gloster Sea Gladiator - kopie.jpg

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47

Sunday, April 17th 2011, 5:36pm

...covering the one piece upper wing frame:
jcvandenbergh has attached the following images:
  • 64 Gloster Sea Gladiator - kopie.jpg
  • 65 Gloster Sea Gladiator - kopie.jpg

ccoyle

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48

Monday, April 18th 2011, 1:17am

Including a jig like that in the kit is really a bold stroke! It will be very interesting to read your final assessment of it once the upper wing has been added.

Cheers!
Chris Coyle
Mariposa, California
USA

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49

Tuesday, April 19th 2011, 4:45pm

Yes, it is an interesting feature and it is also present on these new pictures of the upper wing. The jig fits very well over the complete wing from the left wingtip over the middle to the right wingtip... but what if it had not fitted? There is no real way to correct any mistakes.

On the third picture: a magnifying glass shot of one of the signs that can be found on different places on the bottom of the upper wing, the ailerons etc. Some kind of trademark, or used to make a set of removable parts belonging to the same aircraft? Maybe someone knows.
jcvandenbergh has attached the following images:
  • 66 Gloster Sea Gladiator - kopie.jpg
  • 67 Gloster Sea Gladiator - kopie.jpg
  • 68 Gloster Sea Gladiator - kopie.jpg

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50

Tuesday, April 19th 2011, 5:23pm

Dear JC,

always great to follow your work.
Regarding the W/T-Sign. I don´t know, what it is, but I remember my plastic-kit-times, and these littles Signs has been on all of these british 1:32 planes and has to be sticked on rudders, ailerons and fins.
So, I would say, your assumption that it is a kind of spareparts-classification or similar, is more obvious.
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Royaloakmin

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51

Wednesday, April 20th 2011, 6:44pm

I think Till is right, that these signs are information for the maintenance crews.
best regards
mit herzlichen grussen

Fred

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jcvandenbergh

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52

Thursday, April 21st 2011, 3:19pm

Thanks Gummikuh and Royaloakmin, for thinking about an answer to my question.

I driilled a whole series of mini holes in the lower and upper wing for the cabling... the diagrams, if studied carefully, show the proper location for fixing the shrouds (or cables, or lines? I do not know the correct word in english) except for the crosslinks between the struts - the diagrams are not very clear at that point.
An additional jig (K8) was coupled to the rest of the mould to define the exact position of the upper wing. On the second picture four struts, glued at the bottom to start with, are drying while the upper wing is resting on K8. Four more struts (between the fuselage and the upper wing) will follow soon. Will they be strong enough to hold the upper wing...? These parallellogram connections are so fragile... And the cables, essential in the real plane, will hardly be of any help in the model. (By the way, I do not know yet what material I will use for them: very thin wire, or thread?).
jcvandenbergh has attached the following images:
  • 69 Gloster Sea Gladiator - kopie.jpg
  • 70 Gloster Sea Gladiator - kopie.jpg

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53

Thursday, April 21st 2011, 3:46pm

Dear JC,

apart from your (as ever) impressive build - these templates/tools for lineup are a fantastic idea.
I still remember the deep dark depression during the fixing of my MM-Gladiator-wings.
The whole thing seemes to be really easy now (well.....in comparison).

Regarding your question thread or wire. I´m not shure whether the construction ist similar to my MM-Gladiator, but for this ship it would have been impossible to fix everything without these cables.
I put the upper wing more or less properly on fuselage and lower wing and got the final right position by the tension of the cables.
The author showed little wire-eyes to stick into the wings. With thread through these eyes and careful tension everything slipped right into place. It was still a mess, I can tell you.....

Anyway....I know your perfectionism - and like it very much - but I would suggest thread, since you could give it more or less tension.

Good luck

Till
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  • Gladiator 16.jpg
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54

Thursday, April 21st 2011, 3:49pm

Hello JC,

yes, you have reached the extra tricky part I guess. K8 should be of substantial help.

As far as my experience goes: The upper wing will always remain fragile to a certain extent. My tip would be to fix everything which can be fixed (rudders) to the upper wing before connecting it with the struts.

As far as the cables go, thread needs to get a cvertain amount of tension - difficult to apply. I would opt for wire, perhaps for very thin plastic.

Keep up the great work !

Zaphod

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55

Thursday, April 21st 2011, 6:30pm

Hi JC, usually called flying wires, or bracing wires, as opposed to control cables for the flaps and rudders and such.
best regards
mit herzlichen grussen

Fred

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56

Thursday, April 21st 2011, 7:27pm

Dear Fred,
oooops. As ever, of course you´re right.
Cheers
Till
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57

Thursday, April 21st 2011, 9:45pm

Thank you, Gummikuh, Zaphod and Royaloakmin, for all your suggestions and comments!
On the picture by Gummikuh it looks like there are small eyes to let the flying wires (thanks, Royaloakmin!) pass in order to make several loops with the same piece of thread. Unfortunately, for the Halinski model, each wire has to be made separately, each wire has its own starting point and its own end without any 'fixing device', just the tiny holes in the cardboard that I discussed earlier.
I will try out both the wire and the thread options on a small 'test stand' with two pieces of cardboard functioning as wings and then make a final choice.

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58

Sunday, April 24th 2011, 2:55pm

Whilst the four outer struts could not do without the K8 jig, the four inner struts with their 'spreaded legs' function gave so much strength to the upper wing-lower wing construction that, with all of the eight struts in place, the model can now be handled easily and turned around to rest on the upper wing - a necessary condition for fixing the flight wires:
jcvandenbergh has attached the following images:
  • 71 Gloster Sea Gladiator - kopie.jpg
  • 72 Gloster Sea Gladiator - kopie.jpg

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59

Wednesday, April 27th 2011, 4:30pm

I choose thread after all, the only material that allows you to control the tension, which I found to be an essential condition.
...a hell of a job, all this rigging, and one wrong movement can spoil it all... But look at the result...!
jcvandenbergh has attached the following images:
  • 73 Gloster Sea Gladiator - kopie.jpg
  • 74  Gloster Sea Gladiator - kopie.jpg
  • 75  Gloster Sea Gladiator - kopie.jpg

This post has been edited 1 times, last edit by "jcvandenbergh" (Apr 27th 2011, 4:43pm)


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60

Wednesday, April 27th 2011, 5:04pm

Hello JC,

what a job!

It will bereally difficult where to touch the model from now on.

Zaphod

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61

Wednesday, April 27th 2011, 6:57pm

Hi JC, I am a big fan of waxed cotton thread also. Looks top notch!
best regards
mit herzlichen grussen

Fred

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62

Wednesday, April 27th 2011, 10:22pm

Thanks guys! Glad you like my Gladiator the way it is slowly growing. Indeed I must handlle the model with very much care from now on...
Fortunately the tail section is relatively safe to touch and I will keep using the mould as long as necessary to support the model.
<I'll be back soon after a very short break>

This post has been edited 1 times, last edit by "jcvandenbergh" (Apr 28th 2011, 9:07am)


jcvandenbergh

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63

Thursday, May 5th 2011, 5:29pm

...machine guns under lower wings (soon to be followed by fuselage machine gun barrels):
jcvandenbergh has attached the following images:
  • 76 Gloster Sea Gladiator - kopie.jpg
  • 77 Gloster Sea Gladiator - kopie.jpg

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64

Friday, May 6th 2011, 3:50pm

...the two remaining machine guns in place inside the fuselage:
jcvandenbergh has attached the following images:
  • 78 Gloster Sea Gladiator - kopie.jpg
  • 79 Gloster Sea Gladiator - kopie.jpg
  • 80 Gloster Sea Gladiator - kopie.jpg

Leif Ohlsson

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65

Friday, May 6th 2011, 4:03pm

This is looking so good. You should be pleased with your model, and the job you've made of it so far. Makes me happy to watch. - Leif
Dankbar für die Gelegenheit auf Englisch schreiben zu dürfen, kann aber Antworten problemlos auf Deutsch lesen.

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66

Thursday, May 12th 2011, 5:54pm

Thank you, Leif, to read your words - I am very well aware that you are not just someone on this site..

...working on the rudder...:
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  • 81 Gloster Sea Gladiator - kopie.jpg

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67

Friday, May 13th 2011, 4:37pm

- the rudder in place, held by three hinges;
- rudder control cables were finally attached to the side bars.
- the tail light 'bulb' was made of a pin-head:
jcvandenbergh has attached the following images:
  • 82 Gloster Sea Gladiator - kopie.jpg
  • 83 Gloster Sea Gladiator - kopie.jpg

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68

Monday, May 16th 2011, 4:24pm

... the complete frames for horizontal stabilizers and elevators, with the corresponding skin parts:
jcvandenbergh has attached the following image:
  • 84 Gloster Sea Gladiator - kopie.jpg

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69

Tuesday, May 17th 2011, 6:52pm

...and this is how it looks once everything has been fiited onto the model...

The rudder position is slightly towards the left, but just study my other models and you will see that this is intentional: somehow I do not like all the control surfaces to be placed in a zero degree position.

Additional flying wires were apparently necessary on the Gladiator to assure enough strength fot the tailplanes, so some extra rigging was part of the job:
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  • DSC00001 - kopie.jpg
  • DSC00002 - kopie.jpg
  • DSC00003 - kopie.jpg

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70

Thursday, May 19th 2011, 1:33pm

...two sets of air brakes waiting to be attached to lower and upper wing:
jcvandenbergh has attached the following images:
  • 88  Gloster Sea Gladiator - kopie.jpg
  • 89  Gloster Sea Gladiator - kopie.jpg

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71

Thursday, May 19th 2011, 10:04pm

I suppose it was 'all or nothing' for the dive brakes (i.e. retracted or fully down) because the instructions prescribe a 90 degree angle , so that is what I did. I think it looks great with these four brakes fully down.

On the third image you can see that the support, with the tail section removed and slightly adapted to fit with the added details, is still very usefull, especially to protect the lower wing air brakes.
jcvandenbergh has attached the following images:
  • 90 Gloster Sea Gladiator - kopie.jpg
  • 91 Gloster Sea Gladiator - kopie.jpg
  • 92 Gloster Sea Gladiator - kopie.jpg

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72

Sunday, May 22nd 2011, 12:00pm

... building the two sets of ailerons for upper and lower wing:
jcvandenbergh has attached the following image:
  • 93 Gloster Sea Gladiator - kopie.jpg

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73

Monday, May 23rd 2011, 6:14pm

...all four ailerons, each of them fixed to the wing by three hinges, in place.
The most interesting thing in this step, in my opinion, are the four (two on each side) 0,4mm metal wires connecting te lower and upper wings/ailerons; I suppose these wires were ment to assure a proper simultanious movement of upper and lower ailerons.
jcvandenbergh has attached the following images:
  • 94 Gloster Sea Gladiator - kopie.jpg
  • 95 Gloster Sea Gladiator - kopie.jpg
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74

Monday, May 23rd 2011, 6:35pm

Dear JC,

great! Far better than the old MM-Version.
(I´m still fascinated by your way to fix the gear at last. As Zaphod said before: difficult to handle....)
Regarding the wires between the ailerons. It´s not just the simultaneous movement, but it´s a way to steer only the lower surface and the upper is moved by the wire/pole between them (in fact, it has to be a pole, not a wire).

Cheers

till
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75

Monday, May 23rd 2011, 9:05pm

Hello JC,

fascinating work on the brakes and ailerons.
In my eyes one of the most impressive models done by Halinski over the last few years.

Are you planning to do Halinski´s PZL P.11 too?


Kind regards

Zaphod

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76

Tuesday, May 24th 2011, 11:28am

@ Gummikuh: Yes, of course they have to be poles, otherwise there would not be any direct control between both ailerons; but my wires are poles: unlike all of the flying wires, these are made of metal wire.
Talking about the function I think I know what you mean: the pilot controls the lower ailerons from the cockpit and the poles assure an identical movement of the upper ailerons.

@ Zaphod: my Dauntless is feeling alone... he is waiting for his successor to keep him company. So the Helldiver might well be next...

Leif Ohlsson

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77

Tuesday, May 24th 2011, 2:41pm

Hello friends. About the ailerons - the connection between upper and lower ailerons for the Gladiator in fact seems to have been double wires. The inner, forward wire then seems to have worked as a return wire, eliminating the need for a connecting wire inside the full length of the top wing.

See these images, and others you may find yourself: (1) (2) (3) (4)

Other biplane aileron rigging schemes are with a stiff connecting rod, like you have suggested, or - more commonly - by a return wire running inside the top wing, connecting the two upper ailerons.

The aileron wiring then would form a closed loop with the pilot's control stick at the lower centre.

This is also how an high-winged aircraft like the Piper Cub is rigged.

In the case of the Gladiator, the wires form a closed loop as well, but it seems to run only through the lower wings with a small detour up to the top ailerons and immediately back down again. This is uncommon, and it was interesting to come across it.

JC, I think 0.4mm will serve you fine. The wires seem to have been quite sturdy.

Leif
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  • gladforhang.jpg
  • clouting1.jpg
  • Gloster Gladiator3.jpg
  • gloster_gladiator_9_by_namelessfaithlessgod-d2zijnz.jpg
Dankbar für die Gelegenheit auf Englisch schreiben zu dürfen, kann aber Antworten problemlos auf Deutsch lesen.

This post has been edited 8 times, last edit by "Leif Ohlsson" (May 24th 2011, 3:07pm)


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78

Tuesday, May 24th 2011, 8:19pm

Dear Leif,

thanks for your information (one again....), but who the heck has invented such a mess???? Related to Murphy´s Law there´s much more opportunity to run out of order, than the thing with two poles - especially in a warbird.
On the other hand, I learned, that once a damaged Swordfish flew back to Britain from North Africa with the remaining lower wing, so possibly both ailerons increased the manoeverability, but were not really existencial for flying.
(By the way: a Swordfish by Grygiel/Dworzecki......Wow! The real thing....)


Cheers


Till
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79

Tuesday, May 24th 2011, 9:43pm

I agree with Till...a mickey mouse arangement..but JC's rigging looks great!
best regards
mit herzlichen grussen

Fred

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80

Wednesday, May 25th 2011, 10:45am

Hey, Folks,

without doubt JC´s work looks fine. It´s just the original behing it, which puuzles me.
"Mickey mouse arrangement" sounds nice, I´m still grinning.
Wolfgang passed me a nice link. Unfortunatly it showes lots of interesting details, but not the construction of the aileron-movement.
I fear, it´s to late for you (JC) to answer your questions about wires and all that, but perhaps it may be still of interest.
http://www.flightglobal.com/airspace/med…tor-cutaway.jpg

Cheers

Till
Is das Kunst, oder kann das wech?

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